WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

[LikaNui]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

One thing that he had (note: past tense) at UH was job security. He probably could have coached here as long as he wanted. As long as he didn't have, like, 3-4 mediocre seasons in a row.

Well, how likely is it that we'll have another undefeated season? Not very. After what UH did this year, there's almost nowhere to go but down.

[Mike_Lowery]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

Well, how likely is it that we'll have another undefeated season? Not very. After what UH did this year, there's almost nowhere to go but down.

It's possible. the schedule's made up through what, 2010? 2011, we just need another cake schedule

[LikaNui]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

It's possible. the schedule's made up through what, 2010? 2011, we just need another cake schedule

Heh. But after what just happened with Georgia, it's clear to everyone that UH just isn't a BCS-caliber team. Even with a cake schedule and another undefeated season, I don't think we'd get as high in the various polls as we did this year. You agree?
And apparently SMU has already scheduled a press conference for tomorrow afternoon. June's agent has probably already worked out the details, and June's interview with SMU may just be a formality.

[scrivener]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

All of this stuff is very interesting, and of course we wish things for June Jones and the UHM football team could be as good as at other schools, but ultimately (and I mean ULTIMATELY), the question for the school, the legislature, and the people of Hawaii is how important is college football to the school and to the state?

We know how important it is at other schools, but do we really want to be Ohio State and Michigan? I mean, really? Do we want to be a school that pays its coach a HUGE sum of money to bring success to a football team? As a sports fan, of course I want to say yes, but as an educator, I want to say no.

I'm not saying that the nineteen demands, whatever they are, are not important. I'm saying that there must be a line somewhere, beyond which football becomes more important than education. I can't define it, but I know it's there. I know that boosters ponying (ha!) up ten million bucks in order to lure a big-time coach who will produce results is...disheartening. I don't want us to go there. I don't want that to be us, and I don't want that to be our boosters. The football team already pays for itself and most of the rest of the UH athletic program. This sounds to me like a successful program, win-loss record be damned. Having a team that represents the school and this state with class and dignity is much more important than wins. Wins are nice, but not at any cost.

I don't want to lose June Jones as head coach, but neither do I want us to lose sight of our priorities.

[Pomai]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

Than I'd say put in Cal Lee as head coach, who was one of the prospects JJ recommended (according to KHON2 tonight). Pay Cal what June was being paid, and laters with June Jones. Aloha Oe. Cal Lee will find a way to get the best players we can get into the program. And we'll still have spare change for improvements to UH's athletic facilities.

Crusaders!

All of this stuff is very interesting, and of course we wish things for June Jones and the UHM football team could be as good as at other schools, but ultimately (and I mean ULTIMATELY), the question for the school, the legislature, and the people of Hawaii is how important is college football to the school and to the state?

We know how important it is at other schools, but do we really want to be Ohio State and Michigan? I mean, really? Do we want to be a school that pays its coach a HUGE sum of money to bring success to a football team? As a sports fan, of course I want to say yes, but as an educator, I want to say no.

I'm not saying that the nineteen demands, whatever they are, are not important. I'm saying that there must be a line somewhere, beyond which football becomes more important than education. I can't define it, but I know it's there. I know that booster ponying (ha!) up ten million bucks in order to lure a big-time coach who will produce results is...disheartening. I don't want us to go there. I don't want that to be us, and I don't want that to be our boosters. The football team already pays for itself and most of the rest of the UH athletic program. This sounds to me like a successful program, win-loss record be damned. Having a team that represents the school and this state with class and dignity is much more important than wins. Wins are nice, but not at any cost.

I don't want to lose June Jones as head coach, but neither do I want us to lose sight of our priorities.

[Mike_Lowery]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

Heh. But after what just happened with Georgia, it's clear to everyone that UH just isn't a BCS-caliber team. Even with a cake schedule and another undefeated season, I don't think we'd get as high in the various polls as we did this year. You agree?
And apparently SMU has already scheduled a press conference for tomorrow afternoon. June's agent has probably already worked out the details, and June's interview with SMU may just be a formality.

If I had anything to do with it, I wouldn't have even put this past season's team in the top 15.

All of this stuff is very interesting, and of course we wish things for June Jones and the UHM football team could be as good as at other schools, but ultimately (and I mean ULTIMATELY), the question for the school, the legislature, and the people of Hawaii is how important is college football to the school and to the state?

We know how important it is at other schools, but do we really want to be Ohio State and Michigan? I mean, really? Do we want to be a school that pays its coach a HUGE sum of money to bring success to a football team? As a sports fan, of course I want to say yes, but as an educator, I want to say no.

I'm not saying that the nineteen demands, whatever they are, are not important. I'm saying that there must be a line somewhere, beyond which football becomes more important than education. I can't define it, but I know it's there. I know that booster ponying (ha!) up ten million bucks in order to lure a big-time coach who will produce results is...disheartening. I don't want us to go there. I don't want that to be us, and I don't want that to be our boosters. The football team already pays for itself and most of the rest of the UH athletic program. This sounds to me like a successful program, win-loss record be damned. Having a team that represents the school and this state with class and dignity is much more important than wins. Wins are nice, but not at any cost.

I don't want to lose June Jones as head coach, but neither do I want us to lose sight of our priorities.

Word. Sometimes schools (not just athletic departments) need to look at what direction they want to go. IMO, why try to turn Hawaii into "the Berkley of the Pacific" like a former UH president aimed for, or UH athletics into a Pac-10 caliber team? Let Hawaii be Hawaii.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

All of this stuff is very interesting, and of course we wish things for June Jones and the UHM football team could be as good as at other schools, but ultimately (and I mean ULTIMATELY), the question for the school, the legislature, and the people of Hawaii is how important is college football to the school and to the state?

We know how important it is at other schools, but do we really want to be Ohio State and Michigan? I mean, really? Do we want to be a school that pays its coach a HUGE sum of money to bring success to a football team? As a sports fan, of course I want to say yes, but as an educator, I want to say no.

The way I see it is,... if indeed the people of Hawaii wanted a perennial top 20 program like Ohio St., Michigan, and Texas, they wouldn't just say it with their lips. They would be saying it LOUDLY with their pocketbooks. Those other schools have boosters and a diehard fanbase. Hawaii? We have fair-weather fans who will abandon the team when it struggles. It's been proven time and again. It doesn't matter how many tickets a championship UH team has, whether it be football, basketball, volleyball, baseball. When those teams start losing, attendance goes down. It never fails. Mark my words. If Shoji's teams start to slip, even Wahine v-ball attendance would falter.

So to me, it's not a matter of priorities. If the sports fans of this state step up to the level of commitment that sports fans in other states have for their teams, the question of academics vs. athletics wouldn't be relevant. The sports fans would earmark their dollars towards supporting the teams while the university/state administrations are taking care of the academic needs, as they should be.

[LikaNui]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

Here's a story from KGMB that includes:

KGMB9 has received a copy of a letter that Jones is said to have sent to UH Athletics Director Herman Frazier Saturday morning.
But KGMB9's Liz Chun just spoke to UH officials who said Frazier has not received the letter.
Here is part of what it says:

"It is been very hard the last few days thinking about the decision to leave a place that I love greatly -- but you and I have talked many times about things that have concerned me -- None of those things that concerned me were addressed in this offer...
I guess all I can say is that the way my contract talks have been handled, is kind of the reason I am tired and why I just need to go. He says it is a generous offer. But, it would have meant a lot to me, had this offer come after the bowl game last year or even before the season -- or had it come to me as late as the Washington game it would have said to me 'thanks June for a job well done'
There would have been no negotiating -- I probably would have signed it and never let it get to this point.
Hawaii will always have my heart and that is why this is so hard for me -- but just the fact I am going to get on that plane to Dallas says it all.
I do not want to go -- believe me -- but it is time to go. Mahalo, June."
In his letter, Jones also lists five people as possible replacements: Kevin Gilbride, Dick Tomey, Duane Akina, Norm Chow and Cal Lee.

[Pomai]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

OK, placing the "burden" on the fans is stepping overboard. PPV was already a slap in the face, and now you're saying us fans should be doing "more" ("step up to the level")? What?!!!!

So to me, it's not a matter of priorities. If the sports fans of this state step up to the level of commitment that sports fans in other states have for their teams, the question of academics vs. athletics wouldn't be relevant. The sports fans would earmark their dollars towards supporting the teams while the university/state administrations are taking care of the academic needs, as they should be.

[scrivener]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

Here's a story from KGMB that includes:

Something about that letter doesn't sound right. It might be the Norm Chow / Dick Tomey part.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

OK, placing the "burden" on the fans is stepping overboard. PPV was already a slap in the face, and now you're saying us fans should be doing "more"? What?!!!!

So your definition of a "fan" is someone who stays home and watches the game on TV rather than going out and buying tickets?

And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the reason why UH will never be a perennial top 20 football program.

[Pomai]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

So your definition of a "fan" is someone who stays home and watches the game on TV rather than going out and buying tickets?

And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the reason why UH will never be a perennial top 20 football program.

That's a good point. But still, I think there are ways around this. It just takes a good "business quarterback".

[scrivener]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

The Norm Chow / Dick Tomey / Cal Lee part sounds suspicious. Those are names Hawaii fans WANT to hear. The Gilbride part actually sounds like what I imagine Jones would say, and of course I couldn't fault recommending these three guys, but why Cal and not Ron? And Jones knows you don't rehire a coach you fired. That's pretty much never done in college football.

[Mike_Lowery]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

So your definition of a "fan" is someone who stays home and watches the game on TV rather than going out and buying tickets?

And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the reason why UH will never be a perennial top 20 football program.

fans are not necessarily equated with spending.

as timkona said in an earlier post, Hawaii sports in general lacks organization and tradition. Sometimes I feel embarrassed when Hawaii fans retort to visiting fans cheers and fight songs with fights, projectiles, and taunts (i.e. Michigan, Arizona, USC games).

Hawaii students have organized the Manoa Maniacs for students and alumni to have some sort of organization at sports games, but it doesn't seem to have caught on. how many of you have joined? how many of you know the lyrics to hawaii's fight songs and alma mater?

The Norm Chow / Dick Tomey / Cal Lee part sounds suspicious. Those are names Hawaii fans WANT to hear. The Gilbride part actually sounds like what I imagine Jones would say, and of course I couldn't fault recommending these three guys, but why Cal and not Ron? And Jones knows you don't rehire a coach you fired. That's pretty much never done in college football.

Same thing crossed my mind.

[LikaNui]

Re: WWJD? SMU Courts June Jones

The backgrounds of all five guys that Jones recommended are at this link.